I agree. Professor Denio taught Hebrew for 40 years and garnered the respect of his peers. It's funny how his articles seem to be virtually buried by the scholarly world.
I agree that the Hebrew points were used correctly but it is important to note that in its early us the J's would have been pronounced as Y's. There is no stand alone J sound in Hebrew as far as it is understood.
Although that is the case, we still write/speak about Jeremiah, Jesus, Joshua, and Jehu in English translations.. Moreover, Yahweh is a reconstructed pronunciation that may not be adequate if George W. Buchanan is correct. He suggested that the Tetra could be trisyllabic instead of bisyllabic. WT Publications generally state that the exact pronunciation of YHWH is unknown.
Some feel that the Hebrew use theophonetic? ( is that right) names from Jehovah, most are trisyllabic as well. If I understand things correctly. Good stuff
Duncan, I am sure that someone else could speak to this matter more authoritatively/correctly than me, but it seems that the I and J sounds were clearly distinguished by 1524.
You might also know that the Latin word iam can be spelled jam like iustus/justus. In any event, I don't get hung up on pronunciations of YHWH, but I took Denio to be focusing on English in his remarks.
Philip, I believe you're thinking of theophoric. If you have not read Buchanan yet, he is worth perusing; so is Gordon, who Duncan mentioned. I also find John Gill and Gesenius interesting where the Divine Name is concerned.
Here is John Gill's work wherein he discusses the sacred Tetragrammaton. https://books.google.com/books?hl=en&lr=&id=Xg9ZAAAAcAAJ&oi=fnd&pg=PA1&dq=tetragrammaton+john+gill&ots=1LC1NguQZL&sig=txiSwQMmlsKD0MvsLVM2m-CcjGg#v=onepage&q=tetragrammaton%20john%20gill&f=false
I don't know if it is authentic, but supposedly someone put a recent recording of the high priest in Israel pronouncing the divine name on You-tube. As I listened to it, it most definitely was not Yahweh, it was either Yehowah, or Yehovah, I could not quite distinguish the difference in the W and V. Maybe you can hear the sound difference.
Really well said. I could not agree more.
ReplyDeleteI agree. Professor Denio taught Hebrew for 40 years and garnered the respect of his peers. It's funny how his articles seem to be virtually buried by the scholarly world.
ReplyDeleteI agree that the Hebrew points were used correctly but it is important to note that in its early us the J's would have been pronounced as Y's. There is no stand alone J sound in Hebrew as far as it is understood.
ReplyDeleteAlthough that is the case, we still write/speak about Jeremiah, Jesus, Joshua, and Jehu in English translations.. Moreover, Yahweh is a reconstructed pronunciation that may not be adequate if George W. Buchanan is correct. He suggested that the Tetra could be trisyllabic instead of bisyllabic. WT Publications generally state that the exact pronunciation of YHWH is unknown.
ReplyDeleteAll that I am saying is the names would be pronounced yeremiah, yesus, yoshua, and yehu at the time they were first translated this way.
ReplyDeletehttps://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/1611_Psalms-83-18/
Geneva 1599 spells it jehovah but at the time it would be pronounced about the same.
Nehemiah Gordon thinks the trisyllabic pronunciation yehovah is quite possible. He has found plausible evidence for the "v" sound.
ReplyDeleteSome feel that the Hebrew use theophonetic? ( is that right) names from Jehovah, most are trisyllabic as well. If I understand things correctly. Good stuff
ReplyDeleteDuncan, I am sure that someone else could speak to this matter more authoritatively/correctly than me, but it seems that the I and J sounds were clearly distinguished by 1524.
ReplyDeleteYou might also know that the Latin word iam can be spelled jam like iustus/justus. In any event, I don't get hung up on pronunciations of YHWH, but I took Denio to be focusing on English in his remarks.
Philip, I believe you're thinking of theophoric. If you have not read Buchanan yet, he is worth perusing; so is Gordon, who Duncan mentioned. I also find John Gill and Gesenius interesting where the Divine Name is concerned.
I think I should persue this a little further.
ReplyDeletehttps://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/J
A distinctive sound "y".
http://www.dutchgrammar.com/en/?n=SpellingAndPronunciation.22
ReplyDeleteThis may also be relevant.
https://archive.org/stream/TheGenevaBible1560/geneva_bible1560#page/n509/mode/2up
ReplyDeleteNote that the original Geneva has "Iehovah" but would still be pronounced "Y".
Lastly see:-
ReplyDeletehttp://www.dictionary.com/browse/j
See section "Word Origin and History for J, j"
With all this said - I agree that the modern pronunciation is as good as any for being recognized as the divine name.
https://archive.org/stream/TheGenevaBible1560/geneva_bible1560#page/n955/mode/2up
ReplyDeleteThis page covers the other name examples.
One thing I do not understand is why this is not made clear in the same way as is explained for the letter C being pronounced as a K.
ReplyDeletehttps://books.google.co.uk/books?id=kLIeVfvJU0AC&pg=PA315&lpg=PA315&dq=%22dzh%22+pronunciation&source=bl&ots=2AffdIZdXV&sig=5aMTUDn93heCkysltiWwI9GkIYw&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjWv8WwoKfVAhWmBcAKHVyVBhcQ6AEIRzAF#v=onepage&q=(dzh)%20&f=false
ReplyDeleteSee page 104.
This adds the level of complexity I,Y used indiscriminately.
Here is John Gill's work wherein he discusses the sacred Tetragrammaton. https://books.google.com/books?hl=en&lr=&id=Xg9ZAAAAcAAJ&oi=fnd&pg=PA1&dq=tetragrammaton+john+gill&ots=1LC1NguQZL&sig=txiSwQMmlsKD0MvsLVM2m-CcjGg#v=onepage&q=tetragrammaton%20john%20gill&f=false
ReplyDeleteI don't know if it is authentic, but supposedly someone put a recent recording of the high priest in Israel pronouncing the divine name on You-tube. As I listened to it, it most definitely was not Yahweh, it was either Yehowah, or Yehovah, I could not quite distinguish the difference in the W and V. Maybe you can hear the sound difference.
ReplyDeleteFor some thoughts on the W or V sound in Hebrew, see https://www.bibleodyssey.org/en/tools/ask-a-scholar/ancient-hebrew.aspx
ReplyDeleteFor another perspective on the VAV see:-
ReplyDeletehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0td4d2UGP0k&t=121s
That video is also significant on the english pronunciations that include a B (V).
ReplyDeleteI suppose I should have looked here first:-
ReplyDeletehttp://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=J&allowed_in_frame=0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8AsckpKoC1A
ReplyDelete