here's an other link on the construct state: https://books.google.com/books?id=HDZh8cQRAH0C&pg=PA254&lpg=PA254&dq=fear+of+god+hebrew+construct+state&source=bl&ots=mDKRAVcOLp&sig=Ugom5X000KqgpNIR9iF94Ro7vaU&hl=en&sa=X&ei=_CqoVIz0EoGeyAS3vYKwCA&ved=0CDcQ6AEwBTgK#v=onepage&q=fear%20of%20god%20hebrew%20construct%20state&f=false
If the link gets mingled, please see page 253ff in the grammar by Marcus Moritz Kalisch.
To be clear, you will not get an argument from me concerning the construct state being used in the Tanakh. However, my point is that the construct can be used subjectively or objectively depending on context. The links I reference in this thread seem to understand "the fear of YHWH" objectively (for the most part) rather than construing yirah subjectively.
I wonder if these translators were leaning towards Hebrew Primacy since Fear does not seem to be included in the Greek term?
I would have expected:-
G5401 φόβος phobos Thayer Definition: 1) fear, dread, terror 1a) that which strikes terror 2) reverence for one’s husband
or
phobeō Thayer Definition: 1) to put to flight by terrifying (to scare away) 1a) to put to flight, to flee 1b) to fear, be afraid 1b1) to be struck with fear, to be seized with alarm 1b1a) of those startled by strange sights or occurrences 1b1b) of those struck with amazement 1b2) to fear, be afraid of one 1b3) to fear (i.e. hesitate) to do something (for fear of harm) 1c) to reverence, venerate, to treat with deference or reverential obedience
9 comments:
Edgar,
I have just found this:-
http://individual.utoronto.ca/daphna_heller/research/Heller2002a.pdf
This is just the beginning & if it supports my claim it will have a significant impact on isaiah 9:6 also.
You might also benefit from reading the Hebrew-Chaldee Lexicon by Julius Fürst, pages 602-4.
https://books.google.com/books?id=ELwsAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA603&lpg=PA603&dq=fear+of+god+hebrew+construct+state&source=bl&ots=jT41el1e-_&sig=SIRduS00rz46Pb7QyWJjk1LkTwo&hl=en&sa=X&ei=hCWoVM_cJcW2yATZooKgAw&ved=0CDsQ6AEwBg#v=onepage&q=fear%20of%20god%20hebrew%20construct%20state&f=false
Duncan,
here's an other link on the construct state: https://books.google.com/books?id=HDZh8cQRAH0C&pg=PA254&lpg=PA254&dq=fear+of+god+hebrew+construct+state&source=bl&ots=mDKRAVcOLp&sig=Ugom5X000KqgpNIR9iF94Ro7vaU&hl=en&sa=X&ei=_CqoVIz0EoGeyAS3vYKwCA&ved=0CDcQ6AEwBTgK#v=onepage&q=fear%20of%20god%20hebrew%20construct%20state&f=false
If the link gets mingled, please see page 253ff in the grammar by Marcus Moritz Kalisch.
Edgar,
http://books.google.co.uk/books?hl=en&lr=&id=o3arBQuPI34C&oi=fnd&pg=PA111&dq=proto+semitic+construct+state&ots=72PrHlF_1o&sig=SvkP1Ag8ucTuk5npoRVQkGUtbJw#v=onepage&q=construct%20state&f=false
Duncan,
To be clear, you will not get an argument from me concerning the construct state being used in the Tanakh. However, my point is that the construct can be used subjectively or objectively depending on context. The links I reference in this thread seem to understand "the fear of YHWH" objectively (for the most part) rather than construing yirah subjectively.
Edgar,
No argument from me, but this has connected me to a related point.
ABP-G 1Ti 6:6 εστι δε πορισμος μεγας η ευσεβεια μετα αυταρκειας
G2150
εὐσέβεια
eusebeia
Thayer Definition:
1) reverence, respect
2) piety towards God, godliness
My interest is in the NWT footnote:-
“Godly devotion,” אAVg; J7,8, “fear of Jehovah.”
What is אAVg; J7,8 ?
Duncan,
these sigla can all be found on page 9 of the 1984 NWT, but here they are:
א (ʼAleph) Codex Sinaiticus, Gr., fourth cent. C.E., British Museum, H.S., G.S.
A Codex Alexandrinus, Gr., fifth cent. C.E., British Museum, H.S., G.S.
Vg = the Vulgate
J7 Christian Greek Scriptures in 12 languages, including Heb., by Elias Hutter, Nuremberg, 1599.
J8 Christian Greek Scriptures, Heb., by William Robertson, London, 1661.
Regards,
Edgar
Thanks Edgar,
OOPS - I was searching WTlib for אAVg as a single string - no wonder I could not find it :)
Edgar,
J7
https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=RPDSTS_QL4oC&pg=PA95&dq=polyglot++Elias+Hutter,&hl=en&sa=X&ei=PlWtVN_6KMGvUdnOgKAL&ved=0CCYQ6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=polyglot%20%20Elias%20Hutter%2C&f=false
J8
https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=RPDSTS_QL4oC&pg=PA95&dq=polyglot++Elias+Hutter,&hl=en&sa=X&ei=PlWtVN_6KMGvUdnOgKAL&ved=0CCYQ6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=robertson&f=false
I wonder if these translators were leaning towards Hebrew Primacy since Fear does not seem to be included in the Greek term?
I would have expected:-
G5401
φόβος
phobos
Thayer Definition:
1) fear, dread, terror
1a) that which strikes terror
2) reverence for one’s husband
or
phobeō
Thayer Definition:
1) to put to flight by terrifying (to scare away)
1a) to put to flight, to flee
1b) to fear, be afraid
1b1) to be struck with fear, to be seized with alarm
1b1a) of those startled by strange sights or occurrences
1b1b) of those struck with amazement
1b2) to fear, be afraid of one
1b3) to fear (i.e. hesitate) to do something (for fear of harm)
1c) to reverence, venerate, to treat with deference or reverential obedience
on the basis of Eph 5:21, 5:33, Heb 11:23.
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